I've tried these 3.81 drivers and they are STILL not as fast (or stable ) as the Win2k drivers from creative labs. I DO have a CL TNT2 card, but untill now I thought nvidia was nvidia was nvidia! I have no doubt that most of you are getting good results from these, but I used Wintune benchmark to check. OpenGL with 3.81 was at 10% of the reference card (GeForce). The creative drivers run at 80%. Gyess I 'd better get a GeForce!