XP vs. 2000 with a hint of Linux

[Admiral LSD 0]

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Unfortunately, the more and more diverse they get, the more you either different they become *or* more "legacy" code that has to stay behind for compatibility. Either way, it doesn't seem like such a good case.

The distro makers don't control the code, they only compile and package existing open source software and add a few bits and pieces of their own. Control of the code ultimately lies with the original developers of the software.

[clutch 1]

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But from experience in the working world, the *nix machines seem to be much more reliable than the windows servers and desktops, not trying to dis windows, just a reality I have seen. (but thats what keeps us in jobs )

So your "experience" with both of these operating systems hinges on some articles that you read as indicated below, correct? OK...

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When i read that it was win2k server vs linux (redhat i think, 7?)
It was rateing their networking and file systems (NTFS and EXT2)
But ext3 is wompin on ntfs even more than ext2 did.
As for security, the usual, hole..exploits.. all that jazz.
For instance IIS vs the default installed apache server (a whole different test)
you have to admit, IIS vs Apache, apache wins no problem.

I have never seen these tests, but I wonder who "paid" for them. As for anyone that runs a default installation of anything as critical as a web server, they get what they deserve. Now, you are stating that in one set of benches MS won because they bought the benchmarks (or something similar), but in this case these results *must* be valid, right?

Welp, here's what I have seen in my experience; much more care goes into the adminstration of the average Unix server than the average Windows server. That's where you will see a great deal of problems, and will continue to. Then, to top that off, there are so many Windows machines that there are many more targets to play with for hackers and script kiddies. There are too many Windows admins that are not properly trained, so they just throw everything on the box and don't pay attention to it. On top of that, many small businesses run Windows boxes (since they are cheaper) and stack all kinds of applications on it to the point of overloading it, or they install poorly written applications that take the server down. If there was as much care taken when installing Windows machines as there was with Unix (due to the expensive nature of the box, OS, and admins), you would more than likely see a different picture. Actually, on my networks I see a different picture everyday...

[jdulmage 0]

Yea well all I can submit to this thread is that Windows 2000 Server with Apache is awesome.

 

The end.

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The distro makers don't control the code, they only compile and package existing open source software and add a few bits and pieces of their own. Control of the code ultimately lies with the original developers of the software.

And wasn't there a good deal of fighting between the core group recently? Isn't this fundamentally the same anyway; a single group controlling the OS? And if a group of volunteers (essentially they volunteer their time, right?) can't agree on something, then does it sit or does one person have the deciding vote over the direction? I have seen democracy slow down a good deal of decisions in instances, so do you think that democracy is something that will work for software in the long term if it gets *really* big?

[Xelerated 0]

I read about the tests on slashdot.org, there was a link to where the tests were actually done, if i get the time ill post the links.

The company that did the testing is a known MS lackey

One of the tests, the same test was done by another company and the results, while were less far apart, linux came out ahead.

the original tests made it look like win2k was a universe ahead of linux, where the second test showed linux being ahead of win2k but not

THAT drastic of a different (but enough of one)

[{C}a5c4d3 0]

Still, i didnt get an answer about who took responsibility of the security bugs in Linux?

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I read about the tests on slashdot.org, there was a link to where the tests were actually done, if i get the time ill post the links.
The company that did the testing is a known MS lackey

LOL

Slashdot eh? *nix lackies unite! Sure, if you get the links I'll check them out as they might be interesting.

[Xelerated 0]

Linux VS NT in real world tests.

http://www.heise.de/ct/english/99/13/186-1/

 

and this is a slashdot link instead of other links just because

it has so many, and im lazy.

http://features.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=99/04/23/1316228&mode=thread&tid=109

 

The benchmark had been paid for by Microsoft. The Mindcraft press release failed to mention this fact.

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OK, you are referencing a benchmark comparison for NT4(SP4) with an old Linux box? This isn't the comparison between Win2K server and RH7 that you mentioned earlier (unless I missed it in the link to the "unbiased" test). I would imagine that they would only bench NT4, as the article was dated OCT '99. And btw, why not use SP5 or SP6 at that time? I could have sworn SP6 was out by then, but that's been a while back...

[Four and Twenty 0]

yea i found the article to be a bit dated also

Win2k brought major advancements in IIS, NTFS, tread handling and scalability. Now with Windows.NET just around the corner proving to be stronger in the betas then even XP and the .NET iniative gaining serious momentum the NT platform has become even more speedy and reliable. I haven't heard much about linux for a while but my opinion remains the same. You get what you pay for, Microsoft makes a superior product but they want your money for it (sounds fair to me)

[manifest 0]

I know that there is a linux initiative for the .net framework and it is being written right now. I don't have time to look for any links (hopefully i'll remember when i get home). MS wants .net framework everywhere so letting the open source community use it will be good for them in the long run.

[CyberGenX 0]

Just installed Mandrake 8.2, runs great! Anyone know what the h@ll I need to do to connect to my server's shares on my lan? Other than that it's nice, but Win2000 is still my No. 1 HO.

[Xelerated 0]

allrighty then, you do the search for it, i was just copying and pasting, but i do know what i read.

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Just installed Mandrake 8.2, runs great! Anyone know what the h@ll I need to do to connect to my server's shares on my lan? Other than that it's nice, but Win2000 is still my No. 1 HO.

You need SAMBA, and you might as well get friendly with SWAT (an html-based editor) to make it nice and easy to configure your shares. Domain authentication wasn't bad in NT4 domains (and I imagine AD mixed-mode would be the same), but I don't know how it would connect to AD domains running in native mode.

[clutch 1]

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allrighty then, you do the search for it, i was just copying and pasting, but i do know what i read.

Nahh, I just wanted to see the articles and experience that you used to base your claims, that's all. If you happen to come across either, let me know.

[CyberGenX 0]

SAMBA goes on the NT machine or Linux or both? Sorry I am so lazy and don't just go to a Linux forum, but imagine how NT newbies get treated here. I don't want that headache, yet.

[clutch 1]

It goes on the Linux box, sparky...

 

It's pretty sweet, but earlier versions required a fair amount of setup and tweaking to get them to work at all (and in some cases people were forced to make NT repeatedly transmit credentials in clear text, ick!). It should be rather straight forward now, and the module is *probably* already loaded on your distro. So, check out www.samba.org and they should have more info for you (that's where I went, even though I wound up getting a book on it anyway).

[Xelerated 0]

SMB (aka samba) is a network service winderz uses, its already there. just need it on the linux side of things.

i think i explained that right, i know what i mean, i think i got it out right

[Admiral LSD 0]

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It goes on the Linux box, sparky...

It's pretty sweet, but earlier versions required a fair amount of setup and tweaking to get them to work at all (and in some cases people were forced to make NT repeatedly transmit credentials in clear text, ick!). It should be rather straight forward now, and the module is *probably* already loaded on your distro. So, check out www.samba.org and they should have more info for you (that's where I went, even though I wound up getting a book on it anyway).

Heh, getting rid of that retarded password encryption is the first thing I do with new installs of Windows around here. Editing a single registry key on the Windows boxes is a hell of a lot simpler than setting Samba up to use the encrypted passwords.

There are several front end configuration systems for Samba, a web based system, SWAT, or Samba Web Administration Tool comes with the package, but I don't like what these do to the configuration file (plus many of these utilities didn't really exist when I started using it) so I edit the main smb.conf (either in /etc or /etc/samba) file. The file is well commented so it isn't that hard to edit.

[clutch 1]

Ack, you disable password encryption? Seems like a dangerous practice, even in low risk networks.

[Xelerated 0]

From what I understand SMB/Samba even with encryption is not very hard. I have a buddy that uses it on an all Linux network with a win2k box for mp3s and some apps. Works well, and i think he had it working in minutes.

[clutch 1]

The more current versions shouldn't be too hard, especially with the SWAT configurator. I would also suggest sticking with encryption whether or not you plan on running a *nix box on any NT network.

[CyberGenX 0]

Thanks, by the way my dual video card, dual monitors worked with only a 2 reboot config. Mandrake supported it almost instantly. I still haven't put in the ATA 100 patch yet so it runs a little slow(er). I will try the Samba mamba again with 'drake, I'm sure I can get it on the 2nd try. Everything else was automatic, internet, sound card, nic (of course). Still wish they had more support for drivers and apps.

 

BTW how did you know my nickname is Sparky! 8)

[Xelerated 0]

Ok, I have had the final MS straw. Had a dumbarse, excel froze and hung, windows lost every freaking printer that WAS installed on it, and when i tried to readd a printer it couldnt find any lpt ports.

SCREW MS! im going to go home and delete xp and make my machine dedicated linux, sell my games that only run on windows and live HAPPILY ever after!

[clutch 1]

Swell.