DVD Won't Stay DMA Enabled!

[2D 0]

I thought I would ask for fellow opinions on this. It's been driving me nuts for months.

 

By the way, before I describe the problem, I should let you know that I've searched the forums and archives at http://www.ntcompatible.com and http://www.storagereview.com. This problem seems to be somewhat common, yet nobody seems to have a permanent solution.

 

The problem I described also occurred on old A7V. Hence, it is not particular to the Iwill board. Also, I have read about this problem occuring on motherboards that use Intel chipsets as well as Via chipsets.

 

Additional Environment Information beyond what is in my signature:

 

Primary IDE Master: Diamond Max Plus 40

Primary IDE Slave: None

Secondary IDE Master: Asus E608 DVD-ROM

Secondary Slave: None

 

The Problem:

 

My DVD drive won't stay DMA enabled, no matter what I try.

 

Win2K IDE Properties for Secondary IDE Master:

 

Use DMA if available

 

Current Mode for Secondary IDE Master:

 

PIO Mode

 

BIOS settings for Secondary IDE Master:

 

Auto

 

 

When I first set up the system, everything was hunky dory. For the first week, my DVD drive was showing up as being DMA enabled in Device Manager. The drive does support UDMA 2.

 

Then, for no apparent reason that I can tell, the DVD drive drops down to PIO Mode.

 

I have changed nothing in the BIOS. I have not changed any device drivers.

 

Why is the DMA setting relevant?

 

Many DVD software decoders won't work unless DMA is enabled. Hence, now that I've dropped down to PIO Mode, I can no longer play DVDs.

 

Things I've tried:

 

Moving the DVD drive to another plug on the IDE cable.

 

Result: nada

 

Changing the Bios to PNP Yes.

 

Result: zippo (I changed it back to No after this didn't work)

 

Removing the DVD-drive from the system. Let Win2K reboot without the device present Now add the drive back:

 

Result: bzzzt

 

Trying a different IDE cable:

 

Result: waah-waah

 

Flashing the DVD-ROM Bios:

 

Result: The problem went away for a while, but then came back.

 

Trying the 4.28 Bus Master drivers:

 

Result: All the expected 4.28 problems, and no resolution for my problems. I ripped the 4.28s out after that. Now running 4.25.

 

Some final notes:

 

Others on alternative forums also report this problem with Pioneer, Aopen, and possibly Creative drives, too. So the problem does not appear unique to Asus's DVD drives.

 

Windows 2000 boots faster now that the DVD is in PIO mode. I find this interesting, almost as if before, when DMA was working, it would spend a long time during boot up trying to decide if the DVD was DMA enabled or not.

 

I'm convinced at this point that W2K has some problems with DMA and DVD. I checked the SP2 fix list and saw nothing relevant.

 

I'd rather not get a SCSI DVD if I don't have to...

 

Please help. This is driving me crazy.

 

2D

[Wolf87 0]

Did you install the ASPI layer? DVD needs it and find installation instructions here:

 

http://www.flexion.org/aspi/

[2D 0]

Thank you for the tip. I'll give it a try.

 

However, how is that going to help Win2K enable DMA?

 

2D

[Brian Frank 0]

Are you running your system off the ATA100 controllers. In the documentation, they say that the ATA100s cant run anything but hard drives. Just have your hard drives on these controllers and have your other drives on the normal controllers. Ive got mine setup that way.

[2D 0]

I just tried the ASPI drivers. After rebooting after the ASPI install, there is no change in my ability to enable DMA.

 

I'm running my DVD drive my Secondary IDE channel, which is only ATA 33.

 

2D

 

[This message has been edited by 2D (edited 27 February 2001).]

[Wolf87 0]

Brian Frank asked a good question. Remember that ATA66 and ATA100 are disabled by default in Windows 2000. Besides Asus CD-ROM are not firmware upgradeable.

 

What motherboard do you have and does it have one or 2 controllers? Which are ATA100 enabled? Did you also enable it for your hard disc with the Maxtor sofware? Did you use the Microsoft HotFix for ATA100? Does your controller firmware allow ATA100? Did you install the latest motherboard BIOS?

 

Go to Start and Run Regedit. First make a backup of your Registry (export). Then check the contents of H_Key_LocalMachine, System, CurrentControlSet, Control, Class, {4D36E96A-E325-11CE-BFC1-008002BE10318}, 0000.

 

Read the Driverdesc line, is it Intel82371 AB/EB... written there and do you also have DWORD "EnableUDMA66" present? Then check 0001 and all following entries. The first are the controllers, the rest are the primary and secondary IDE channels.

 

The ATA100 Command Controller should be the only one with "EnableUDMA66" activated (1).

[2D 0]

Regarding the questions:

 

Brian Frank asked a good question. Remember that ATA66 and ATA100 are disabled by default in Windows 2000.

 

The Primary IDE channel is my only ATA100 channel. It is only running at ATA33 right now. However, I don't mind this, as my HD's maximum sustained transfer rate is <33MB/s. Running my HD at ATA 33 doesn't worry me.

 

Besides Asus CD-ROM are not firmware upgradeable.

 

I don't know about the CD-ROM, but the Asus DVD player is firmware upgradable. You can find the firmware here:

 

http://perso.club-internet.fr/farzeno/firmware/

 

In any case, upgrading the firmware made no difference.

 

What motherboard do you have and does it have one or 2 controllers?/b]

 

I have an Iwill KK266. This uses a Via KT133A Northbridge and a Via 686B Southbridge. This motherboard supports ATA100. It has two IDE controllers.

 

My previous motherboard was an Asus A7V. This used a KT133 Northbridge and a Via 686A Southbridge. My old motherboard supported only ATA66.

 

Both motherboards exhibited this problem, so I doubt it is related to ATA100.

 

Which are ATA100 enabled?

The Primary IDE channel is ATA66/100 capable.

 

The Secondary IDE channel is only ATA33.

 

Did you also enable it for your hard disc with the Maxtor sofware?

 

No, because my HD is not ATA100 capable. My HD is working without any problems.

 

 

Did you use the Microsoft HotFix for ATA100?

 

No, because I don't have any ATA 100 devices.

Also, the problem does not occur on the Primary channel (the ATA100-capable channel).

 

The problem occurs on the Secondary channel, which is only ATA33.

 

Does your controller firmware allow ATA100?

 

The IDE controller is ATA100 capable on the Primary channel.

 

There are no problems on the Primary channel. The HD on that channel is working fine.

 

Did you install the latest motherboard BIOS?

 

The BIOS is dated January, 2001. No newer BIOS is available yet.

 

Also, on my last motherboard(Asus A7V), I went through 3 revisions of BIOS. The problem was never solved.

 

The BIOS recognizes the DVD-ROM drive correctly, as being UDMA2 capable.

 

It is Windows which is not recognizing the drive correctly.

 

Go to Start and Run Regedit. First make a backup of your Registry (export). Then check the contents of H_Key_LocalMachine, System, CurrentControlSet, Control, Class, {4D36E96A-E325-11CE-BFC1-008002BE10318}, 0000.

 

Read the Driverdesc line, is it Intel82371 AB/EB... written there and do you also have DWORD "EnableUDMA66" present? Then check 0001 and all following entries. The first are the controllers, the rest are the primary and secondary IDE channels.

 

The Driverdesc line in the 0000 sub-hive says:

 

VIA Bus Master IDE Controller

 

There is no DWORD key that says EnableUDMA66. In fact, there are no DWORDs in the 0000 sub-hive at all.

 

There are also no keys named "EnableUDMA66" in the 0001 and 0002 hives. This might be a difference between Intel chipset motherboards and Via chipset motherboards.

 

There are various other DWORD keys with names like "MasterDeviceType" and "MasterDeviceTimingMode", and "MasterDeviceTimingModeAllowed". Of course, these are hexadecimal values, so I would only be able to make educated guesses as to the current configuration.

 

The ATA100 Command Controller should be the only one with "EnableUDMA66" activated (1).

 

There is no "EnabledUDMA66" key on my system, not in 0000, 0001, or 0002. This key might be Intel chipset specific.

 

Finally, I don't think this problem is Via specific, as according to the archives here, people have received these problems on old BX chipsets, as well.

 

If you have any more ideas, please let me know.

 

Thank you,

 

2D

[Brian Frank 0]

Are you sure youve got the A7V Im talking about...the original. It has the 2 usual IDE controllers ATA33/66 and then 2 additional ATA33/66/100s. If you have the DVD-hooked up to primary (or secondary for that matter), that is likely the cause of your problems, since the documentation states that the ATA33/66/100 controllers havent been said to run anything but hard drives. The ATA33/66/100 controllers are in front of the BIOS chip, NOT the Dimm slots.

[2D 0]

Sorry, I should have said that the Secondary was ATA 33/66, not ATA33 only. You're correct.

 

The Iwill KK266 is similar to the A7V (actually, it's more similar to the A7V133). I'm not longer using the A7V. I mentioned the A7V only as a reference, as the problem occurred on to both the my old motherboard (A7) and my current one (KK266). To restate:

 

The Primary IDE is 33/66/100.

 

The Secondary IDE is 33/66.

 

I definitely have the DVD drive hooked up to the Secondary channel. I can confirm this either by looking at the board or looking at Device Manager.

 

I don't think it has anything to do with the connection, as the DVD drive was DMA enabled when I first installed Win2K on the KK266. It just loses its ability to remain DMA capable.

 

Thanks,

 

2D

 

 

 

[This message has been edited by 2D (edited 27 February 2001).]

[Brian Frank 0]

Another thing just came to me. 3dfx boards can cause problems if youve upgraded to or from a 3dfx board without installing, problems can, and usually do occur. I dont know why this is, but it is. If you have done the 3dfx board upgrade without reinstalling Win2k since the change, that's probably your problem. Also, win2k does support ATA66, but that doesnt necessarily mean it will take advantage of it.

You may just have to reinstall win2k.

Have you had heard of a lot of the DVD probs concerning this particular drive.

If you have,or had, a 3dfx card Im betting thats your problem. But only if you havent reinstalled since the vid card change.

[2D 0]

Have you had heard of a lot of the DVD probs concerning this particular drive.

 

I have read similar problems reported for:

 

1. My drive

2. The other Asus DVD drive (E612)

3. Pioneer DVD drives

4. Aopen drives

5. Creative drives

 

If you search the ntcompatible archives on "dvd dma" you'll find lots of similar posts...with no resolution.

 

If you have,or had, a 3dfx card Im betting thats your problem. But only if you havent reinstalled since the vid card change.

 

I've never owned a 3dfx card. My current card is an ATI All-in-Wonder Radeon.

 

Thanks,

 

2D

[Wolf87 0]

This used to be related exclusively to AMD Busmastering and Via drivers.

 

If I remember correctly, this happened with my Athlon 500 and Gigabyte 7IX motherboard. It was due to the AMD Busmaster Driver. Altough the DMA may be unchecked, the DVD was using UDMA but with a false DMA report.

 

Microsoft has generalized this false report for ATA100 motherboards: "you may notice an incorrect "PIO" value displayed on the Advanced Settings tab for an IDE device in Device Manager. This does not mean that the device is functioning in "PIO" mode. Windows 2000 is displaying an incorrect value.". See

http://support.microsoft.com/support/kb/articles/q260/2/33.asp

 

Whether the DVD operates in DMA, UDMA mode or PIO appears in the Registry under SCSI, since ATAPI drives are controlled through ASPI commands (Advanced SCSI Programming Interface). Check: HKey_Local_Machine, Harware, DeviceMap, Scsi, Scsi Port 0, DMA Enabled (1), same for Scsi Port 1 and so on.

 

Alternatively, you may try the Microsoft DMAcheck program for NT 4 SP3 found here:

 

http://support.microsoft.com/support/kb/articles/Q191/7/74.ASP

[2D 0]

Well, I've tried using both DMACHECK.EXE and modifying the registry key. My DVD drive is listed on Scsi Port 1, Scsi Bus 0.

 

I changed the value of "DMAEnabled" to 1.

 

After rebooting, it reverts back to 0.

 

 

2D

[Wolf87 0]

Try uninstalling the AMD Busmaster Driver and check the difference. Probably on each restart it resets the DVD drive to PIO mode.

 

The same program that installs it can also uninstall when rerun.

[2D 0]

Well, the Via Bus Master driver that I'm using is the one from Microsoft that Win2K installs by default. The Windows 2000 BM driver from Via is still undergoing Beta testing, therefore I'm not using it.

 

So, in order to uninstall, I went into device manager, selected the device, then chose 'uninstall'. Then I rebooted.

 

Of course, then as I suspected would happen, Win2K detects new hardware and adds the Microsoft BM driver right back in.

 

Now, however, the results are slightly worse.

 

Before this change, the properties under 'Secondary IDE Controller' were listed as 'Use DMA if available' with current mode set to 'PIO'.

 

Now, after removing the BM driver and adding it back in, the 'Use DMA if available' selection is no longer available. Now PIO is the only choice.

 

Running DMACHECK makes no difference. It still remains with PIO as the only choice.

 

Editing the registry key to force DMA to be enabled also makes no difference...Win2K over-writes this on reboot.

 

2D

[Wolf87 0]

There is an IO problem with Iwill KK266 both with Microsoft and Via busmasters drivers:

 

http://www.amdmb.com/vb/showthread.php?threadid=26144

 

Please note that the busmasters drivers cannot be uninstalled from Device Manager. Stubs remain in the inf folder and enum will reinstate them on bootup. A specific removal program is needed or installation of a new busmaster driver that would manage it.

[2D 0]

Thank you for the pointer to amdmb.com. However, I am aware of that thread, as I posted on it under the name DD.

 

Given that the installation 'program' is Win2K itself, and not a 3rd party installation program, how do you propose I remove the MS BM IDE drivers for Via chipsets?

 

Finally, I fear that doing so will cause Win2K to lose its reference to my IDE controllers. Whenever I've uninstalled the BM driver in the past, Win2K also removed the Device Manager references to my Primary and Secondary IDE controllers.

 

2D

[Wolf87 0]

Check this page referred to in Technet: http://www.microsoft.com/technet/

 

http://support.microsoft.com/support/kb/articles/Q151/9/11.asp

 

Via in their FAQ suggests avoiding use of their busmaster driver with Windows 2000.

[2D 0]

Thank you, but as I mentioned earlier, I'm not using the Via bus master driver in Windows 2000.

 

I'm using the Microsoft BM IDE driver for the Via chipset. This comes on the Windows 2000 CD.

 

2D

[Wolf87 0]

DMA controller and other software foreign to Microsoft appear in C:\Winnt\inf listes as Oem0.inf, Oem1.inf and so on. Check the contents of those files and remove them if they contain busmaster drivers. Uninstall the Busmaster controller from Device manager and restart. Only Windows 2000 files will be reinstated.

 

Of course if the problem is tied to the Iwill KK266 motherboard, waiting for a bios upgrade may take forever. Via busmaster drivers have never resolved this issue.

 

Finally, maybe a full reinstall of Windows 2000 would solve the problem. Once busmaster drivers are corrupted, this is the solution.

[2D 0]

Solved the problem:

 

1. Completely reinstalled Win2K, SP1

2. Did *not* install any Via drivers except the AGP driver

3. Did not install DirectX 8a (unlikely cause, but I'm being paranoid)

 

Where does the culprit lie?

 

I'm not sure. It could be the Via updated .INF file, which I also have not installed, although I doubt it. Corrupted BM drivers, as you mentioned? Possibly, although I'm not sure how. Corrupt registry? Seems also pretty possible.

 

DMA is now enabled on the DVD drive. DVDs play, although it is dropping a few frames. However, it is an improvement.

 

I just hope it stays this way and doesn't 'lose' it's DMA setting again.

 

Thanks for all the assistance,

 

2D

[2D 0]

Bah...

 

I spoke too soon.

 

The drive has now dropped itself back down to PIO mode again.

 

In fact, I suspect that it never really was in DMA mode, despite what Windows indicated. Why? DVD playback drops frames.

 

Maybe it's time to try another drive...

 

2D

[SHS 0]

Poor 2D man you not have the best of lucky are you ?.

Maybe it just a bad DVD drive.

[2D 0]

I think so. I should have known better than to buy an Asus DVD drive. Really, who uses them, anyway?

 

Time to try a Toshiba or Pioneer?

 

2D

[DJBeSSeR 0]

Is your system overclocked?

 

DJB