Dual boot help needed plz

[JAKKAL 0]

Can u tell me how to dual boot my system??, i just tryed it by using win98 startup disk since win98 wont install thru win2k or boot up. So i tryed to use dos to install it, but it tryed to install it in c: drive and i want it installed to my I: drive since that is my spare drive. I have 4 partitions in my 17gb drive which starts at c: then f:, G:, H: . My two cd drives r d: and E: . So I would like my win98 in drive I: which is on my 8gb drive which i also want to partition.

So my question is how do i get win98 in drive I: so it can be dual booted with win2k ???

Ive done a fresh install just now in i: drive, by swapping the hdd around to make it c:

Could i not just edit the boot.ini to add another os and point it to I:\win98

[DFB 0]

Unfortunately, Win9x doesn't like not being on the first partition. To dual boot, install win98 to c:, then when finished, install win2k (to where ever you wish) and when that is completed, next reboot you should have the option of which OS to use.

[OscarV 0]

But .. if I have Winnt in c: with format NTFS and d:fat32 (the same HD) ...

How I can format C: for install w98 in C: and after Win2000 in D: ????

 

Thanks

 

OScar

[nova 0]

On my system, I have installed Win2k as follows:

 

C: 1GB NTFS (just NT boot loader and 512MB permanent swap file),

D: 1GB NTFS (primary Win2000 installation),

E: 1GB NTFS (secondary Win2000 installation, for recovery and defrag purposes),

F: xGB NTFS (programs & data partition)

 

Then I wanted to additionally install Win98, but it didn't work because Win98 didn't like the boot partition (the partition that contains the boot loader, etc.), which was C: (of course), being NTFS formatted.

 

So I formatted C: back to FAT, and then installed Win98 on the primary partition of my second hard disk (which was previously unsued), which became D: under Win98 (then reinstalling the NT boot loader with the recovery console (or the emergency repair process - select "repair boot sector") from my bootable Win2k CD).

 

I'd recommend NOT to install Win98 and Win2k into the same partition EVER! AND, Win98 installs FINE into other partitions that are not C:, it just needs C: to be FAT/FAT32 so it can read the IO.SYS, MSDOS.SYS, CONFIG.SYS and AUTOEXEC.BAT files that have to reside in C:. The "\Windows" folder can very well be on D:!

 

nova.

 

[This message has been edited by nova (edited 19 January 2000).]

[JAKKAL 0]

so u mean i need to have win98 as my c: drive

so what ive to do is change my hdd round so win98 is my master and win2k is my secondary master.

Then use a bootable win2k disk and repair the boot sector

So then c: will be win98

and g: or what ever itll be will be win2k and then win2k will add a startup boot file so i can pick either os.

Is that right ????

[JAKKAL 0]

so what excactly have i to do??

i have a win98 bootup floppy disk with cdrom support. I dont have a bootable win2k cd though, but i do have a win2k cd. And i tryed running setup in the root dir of the cd in dos and it said that it cant be ran in dos mode. But if i go into "I386" theres a prog called WinNT.exe which takes me into the upgrade bit of win2k, cause it didnt ask for what partition or anything, it just started to copy files. So i presume thats was to upgrade it.

How do i start the win2k cd so i can get the bit to repair the boot sector and stuff??

Please tell me more...

[Yoda 0]

Ok, this may help people who already have win2k installed, want to install 98, and don't have a bootable win2k cd [like me].

I used a win98 boot disc to go through the windows98 installation process. Since that will wreck your boot.ini file, go to http://www.winimage.com and go to the 'bootpart' page. download and install bootpart, reboot to dos [as you should be in 98 at the moment], go to the bootpart dir, and type this....

bootpart winnt boot:c:

 

as it says there. this will restore win2k's OS loader and thus, you can choose to load 98 or win2k on startup.

[Llion 0]

Generally, if you plan to have a multiple-OS-system it´s a good idea to have a 10-50 MB FAT Partition C: as boot-partition.

 

If you have one like that (personally I prefer not to have my swap files in this partition) you don´t have any problem installing W98 after W2k or the other way round. You don´t even need to repair any boot files in addition. Both OS boot (and work) without any problems afterwards.

 

Llion

[k4 0]

Mine is a different case:

 

I have W2k and W98 already installed seperately in a different physical HD. They both can boot up by themselves.

 

What do I need to do to make them dual boot?

[nova 0]

Ok. Is this really THAT hard to understand?

 

Regardless how you connect your drives (master, slave, whatever), you have ONE partition that your BIOS tries to boot from, that is the (active) primary partition on your first connected HD (first IDE channel & master).

 

AND exactly *this* partition must be FAT or FAT32 formatted to allow Win98 to boot on your system!

 

Now there are different ways to achieve this (you even might need to combine them):

- Swap the order in which your HDs are physically connected to the controller,

- Create/convert/reformat the (active) primary partition that shall become your C: partition in BOTH OSes with FAT or FAT32.

 

I cannot give you SPECIFIC guidelines if YOU don't tell me how exactly your drives are laid out (i.e. drive letters, file systems (FAT/FAT32/NTFS)). I just can try to cover some common cases:

 

(I recommend getting Partition Magic 5.0 (**NOT** 4.0 or lower as the older versions sometimes have problems with large HDs, and only 5.0 can resize/move NTFS5 (the new NTFS that comes with Win2000) partitions.)). You might also need a DOS boot disk, look at www.bootdisk.com.)

 

1) *** (OscarV's case) C: is NTFS and contains the \WinNT folder (is that right?), D: is FAT32 and contains no OS files yet. Now, there are no obvious ways to install Win98 on D:, but you can do one of the following:

 

- Create a small FAT/FAT32 partition even BEFORE the NTFS partition that is now C:. You can do this with PM5, and you need to set the new small partition active, else the PC will still boot from the NTFS partition. Then use your bootable Win2k CD (or make win2k installation boot disks before you change your partitions! (on the Win2k CD there should be a directory with a boot disk creation util, or AFAIK you can do it by calling WINNT.EXE (or WINNT32.EXE? I don't know!) with the /? parameter so it gives you an overview of valid parameters; choose the right one to make boot disks!)) to install an NT boot sector on the new partition, then you need to edit BOOT.INI to set the new partition number (usually the last number in the line "multi(x)...(x)...(x)...(Z)\WINNT=..." (here denoted as Z)). Then you can install Win98 on the partition that was D: (and should STILL be D:, as Win98/DOS doesn't recognize NTFS partitions). It might be neccessary to "hide" the NTFS partition as only ONE "primary" partition is allowed with Win98/DOS - this can be done with PM5.

 

- Or you convert (not a trivial task, maybe PM5 can do this)/reformat the C: NTFS partition to a FAT/FAT32 file system. The disadvantage is that the \WINNT folder is no longer on an NTFS partition. That's not so bad, but... well you know what I mean. You also might need to re-install the NT boot sector on that partition (else it still thinks the partition is NTFS). Then you can install Win98 on D:.

 

- Or you decide to completely re-install Win2k. That is the way *I* would go. Backup your important files from the NTFS partition onto floppy disks or burn a CD or use a ZIP disk (or copy them to another partition you are not going to change, e.g. the D: FAT32 partition). Then start PM5. Kill the NTFS partition, create a small (~20MB) FAT partition (primary! and make it active!), then resize the extended partition that encloses the FAT32 partition to start where the small primary FAT partition ends. Then there should be some space INSIDE the extended partition where the NTFS partition was. Here you can create a new NTFS partition (inside the extended partition) and install win2k in it!. This method prevents any problems you might get with invalid boot sectors, inactive partitions, multiple primary partitions, etc. etc. if using one of the above methods.

 

ALL three methods DO work if you do them properly, but the first two are a bit hairy, so you should know what you do (they are just a suggestion by me - if you don't know exactly how to proceed from my explanation, then use the last method!).

 

2) *** (k4's case) In which order do you have the HDs usually connected? (Or do you swap them each time you boot the other OS?) For simplicity purposes I'd suggest putting the Win98 drive as the first drive, then the drive with Win2k on it. Then you need to create an NT boot sector (and the NT startup files) on the Win98 boot ( C: ) partition, so Win2k can be started from it as well. You should use BootPart as Yoda suggested to do this.

 

3) *** (JAKKAL's case) Sorry, please give me more details, else I can't give you specific hints how to install Win98 on your machine.

 

In general, there are only a few things you MUST consider when dual-booting Win2k and Win98:

 

- Win98 *requires* the partition the BIOS boots off (usually C: ) to be FAT/FAT32, so the Win9x/DOS startup files can be read (IO.SYS, MSDOS.SYS, etc. - did you read my previous post?)

- Win98 (i.e. the "\Windows" folder) itself DOES *NOT* need to be on C:, you can VERY WELL choose another place for the windows folder during the installation. I have done this and it DEFINITELY WORKS! (See my previous post for how my system is laid out!)

- There *MUST* not be more than ONE "visible" "primary" partition on ONE hard disk, because that is NOT supported with Win98 and DOS. And it probably won't work. So you may need to HIDE (PM5) one or more primary partition(s) (hide the NT partitions, as NT does not require its own start partition to be "visible", but Win9x/DOS does!).

- WinNT/Win2000 *should* be on a NTFS partition for best results, but this is not really required!

- NEVER install Win2000 into the same FAT/FAT32 partition as Win98! I know that there are people outside who say that it works ok for them, but believe me, one day you WILL regret it! (Because this way, Win2000 and Win98 share the "\Program Files" folder (and maybe some others) on that partition, and it WILL give you compatibility problems in one OS sooner or later if you install some programs!)

 

I hope I haven't forgotten anything important, and that my lengthy text can assist you in repartitioning/formatting/installing your system without serious problems!

 

You can also mail me at nova@cu-muc.de if you want to know more or have problems with my explanation!

 

nova.

 

[This message has been edited by nova (edited 20 January 2000).]

[JAKKAL 0]

Cheers everyone..

Yoda got it spot on.

ive pretty much the same prob as K4

 

but when i change my win98 drive so its c: my win2k drive will probably be something like g: .

So how is this going to affect all my progs and enviroment settings ??????

cause all my progs say c: in win2k, everything is pointing to the c: drive

 

After i change my win98 drive to primary hdd and have my win2k drive as secondary, will win2k repair it so all my progs get redirected ???

 

just now, my drives as follows

(this is all on 1 drive - win2k drive)

 

c: win2k ntfs 4gb

d: dvd

e: cd writer

f: games ntfs 5gb

g: other stuff ntfs 5gb

h: fat 2gb

 

my other drive (win98 drive)

 

I: Win98 fat32 4.2gb

J: other stuff 4.2gb

[Awaxx 0]

You can fix the shortcuts prob with PMagic. It will redirectd every shortcut to the right disc.

 

btw, Nova, you are pretty patient to take that long to explain things that people should be able to understand by themselves. Good job, anyway, I can't have been easier to understand.

 

Awx

 

[This message has been edited by Awaxx (edited 21 January 2000).]

[nova 0]

JAKKAL, Win98 doesn't see (and thus doesn't give drive letters to) NTFS partitions. So if your "Win2k drive" (as you said) is NTFS formatted, you will have no problems with your "Win2k drive" being drive letter G: or so. And under Win2k you can assign drive letters to the partitions yourself (except the boot and system partitions (which can be the same), these must remain the same letter after you have installed Win2k). Just go to Control Panel, Administrative Tools, Computer Management, then click Disk Management. Then right click a drive/partition and you can change the drive letter!

 

nova.

[k4 0]

thanks mova for all the infomation, really appreciated. I understand the concept of bootsector for both W2K and w98 must be in the same partition c:, that's what i DON'T have. I have bootsector of W98 in one drive and bootsector if W2k in another.

 

Please let me know if this is the way to dual boot it.

 

my config:

1. IBM HD: W98 installed as C:\ when other HD are not connected

2. Quantum HD: W2k installed as C:\ when other HD are not connected

 

Should I do:

A. Connect IBM as master c:, and Quantum as slave d:. Boot into c:\W2K and run dos prompt within. and type "c:\bootpart\bootpart 1 BOOTW98.bin W95"

 

OR

 

B. Connect Quantum as master c:, and IBM as slave d:. Boot into c:\w98 dos prompt and type "c:\bootpart\bootpart 1 BOOTNT.BIN WINNT"

 

?

 

Please let me know, I am confused..

 

 

[This message has been edited by k4 (edited 21 January 2000).]

[nova 0]

k4, put the IBM drive as master, and the Quantum as slave. To clarify WHY you need to do it this way: you need a FAT/FAT32 partition as the boot partition.

 

Then you create a Win2k boot sector on the Win98 partition. I don't know whether BootPart can do this for you (I guess it can), but if not, just start Win98, then run

 

X:\I386\WINNT32.EXE /CMDCONS

 

from your Win2k CD. This installs the Win2k recovery console (which, by the way, is a very useful tool to repair your Win2k sometimes), and a Win2k boot sector. It should also have created a boot menu option for your Win98.

 

Then you only need to edit C:\BOOT.INI (that file is usually hidden, and clear the read-only flag before you edit it) to include your Win2k installation. This is an example of MY BOOT.INI, yours might look a bit different, but the "multi(0)..." line under "[operating systems" is EXACTLY how the entry must look like that you need to add by hand:

 

Code:

[boot loader]timeout=5[b]default=multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(1)partition(1)\WinNT[/b][operating systems][b]multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(1)partition(1)\WinNT="Windows 2000 Professional" /fastdetect[/b]C:\CmdCons\BootSect.dat="Windows 2000 Recovery Console" /cmdconsC:\BootSect.w98="Windows 98 / DOS 7.10"

 

The important part of the line you must add is the "rdisk(1)" and "partition(1)" parts: rdisk(1) means second harddisk (counted from 0), and partition(1) means first partition on that drive (counted from 1).

 

The "default=..." line can be modified to start Win98 by default instead if you wish.

"timeout=..." is how many seconds the boot manager waits before automatically booting the default OS.

 

nova.

[Woodlet 0]

I'm chickening out...

setting up i current 98SE, just b4 I start all this..

1) <100Mb C;\ drive -FAT32 on IBM 20GB/66 drive

2) rest-3GB NTFS partition 4 win2k.

3)remaining 3GB fat32 for Mp3's

4)Maxtor 8.4GB -Fat32 for Win98SE.

 

I've got one Question..

how exactly can I reboot my system the one time I'm going to want to w/ that <100 MB partition as primary? maybe del all I can off of current, leave that as primary(instead of creating a <100 MB one, restart, get drive letters, boot to dos, format C:\ as FAT, instal 98 to maxtor, shrink original(current) 98SE partition, and expand previously created NTFS 2k one?

 

Thanks

Woodlet

[nova 0]

Can you please clarify the second part of your message a bit? ("how exactly can I reboot my system the one time.....")

 

I've understood the first part, except what OSes you've currently installed. If I understand you correctly, you've installed Win98 SE on the extra Maxtor 8.4GB drive (being what drive letter?), and using the <100MB partition on your IBM drive as boot partition, right?

 

nova.

[Woodlet 0]

ah..no..sorry, wasn't clear..

currently,, as I JUST got this IBM, I'm down to one drive until I get a splitter for the power cable so I've got 98SE on the 20GB(single fat32) and only have one drive right now..

 

I was referring to how PM4 works. I set it up to do it's thing, creating all those partitions, and then to acually make them, it'll go into dos, and do it's thing. Then I need to restart the computer to SE at least once to make sure it did it right & so I can copy down the drive letters of all my Drives so I know what Drive to install the Os's too.

That clairify?

 

Thanks again

[JAKKAL 0]

X:\I386\WINNT32.EXE /CMDCONS

Nova, i tryed this in win98 like u said to k4

but it said "You can only install the recovery console in windows 2000"

so i tryed it from dos, and it said this cant be ran in dos mode.

So now im stuck.

what i need to do is put my win98 (fat32) drive to the primary master to make it c:

and make my win2k (ntfs) drive sencondary master, so its g:

so, to make me get a dual boot, i need to add a boot sector thing to my primary drive so i can boot either drive

 

thanx for the help so far.

 

[JAKKAL 0]

can anyone help please??

[Woodlet 0]

(warning, newbie posting help, may be wrong, correct me if it is, please!)

IF memory serves, you use a win2k boot disk to help ya out here..

 

If ya need a bootable CD, ICQ me and I'll send ya a link to a site that'll tell you how.

 

Run it from a bootable CD, and it should start the installation, but, gives you the option to fix an existing one. Choose that..

not sure if it's the same thing as was mentioned b4, but..it may help

[JAKKAL 0]

Yoda, that bootpart didnt work

"bootpart winnt boot:c:"

i put win98 to master c:

and win2k to secondary g:

i used win98 startup disk

and then typed in bootpart winnt boot:c:

restarted pc, and win98 is dead now.

it said "NTLDR is missing"

and it just wont load now.

 

Nova, that "recovery console" wont start up in win98 or dos.

I typed WINNT32.EXE /CMDCONS

and it said "You can only install the recovery console from win2k"

 

has anyone got a workable sollution plz ??

[Woodlet 0]

back up all data you want on both OS's

 

delete all non essential stuff off of C:

 

Use PM5, format second HD as NTFS

 

set drive you want 98SE as master, 2k drive as slave.

 

Install 98SE from CD.

Install 2k from bootable CD(seach web for RC3 bootdisk to find site to make one) to second HD.

 

Reinstall software and back up data.

 

Stop asking for help when all have tried. Accpet that that's your only option to get desired results, because either(no offense here man/lady) A)you don't follow directions well B)you do not have the mind for this like some do, and should wait until M$ provides full tech support, then contact them..speed 20$ on hold, 50$ talking to tech.

c)if B, don't feel stupid, I can't figure out a car if my life depended on it..

[k4 0]

Thanks for the effort nove, I tried what you told me to do, but I got the same result as Jackal.. i was so frustrated so I backed up all my important files and did a clean install on both OS (98 & 2K).. things are ok now. thanks!

[JAKKAL 0]

I got my dual boot guys without formatting or any **** that requires bloody ages to reinstall everything!!!

 

I put my win98 as primary drive

win2k secondary

then put my win2k cd in drive in win98

said i wanted a clean install

then when it restarted i said i wanted to repair win2k

went to recovery console bit

and typed something at dosprompt

first typed "help" to find out the commands

i think i typed "fixboot c:"

this gave me a boot menu

then went into win98 and edited boot.ini according to novas recomendations.

 

AND IT ALL WORKED !!!!

 

I didnt even have to change short cuts

cause when i start win2k, win2k is the c: drive and win98 is I:

but when i start win98, win98 is c:

and so on.

 

So, Thanx for all the people who helped me.

I really appreciated it.

This problem has been bothering me for a couple of weeks, and now its all over.

phew.

Anyway, until next time guys

And thanx again.